feeding and diet question

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oowie
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feeding and diet question

Post by oowie » Sat May 23, 2020 8:29 am

years ago i had a group of rats, and i have fed them on a home made scuttling gourmet diet with DE1 and Calcivet and fresh veggies.
later on i changed this to DailyRat3 and no other supplements.
they have also been on a diet with a commercial food base. i did not notice any difference in their health.

at the moment i have a group of 4 males. i started them on science selective nuggets, just to make sure everyone gets what he need nutrient wise.
then i added RRmix. so they had about 50% RR mix, scatter fed in the bedding, and about 50% SS in a bowl.
SS does not have a very high copper amount, so i still supplement with DR3 1 or 2 times a week.

i do not like supplementing in the water and i also do not like using a DE1, because i hope they can get everything from the drymix + veggies, and now the SS.
but what if i stop using SS?
how can i be sure that all of them get the needed nutrients, vitamins and minerals?
i know with SS you have to trust the manufacterer, and they do not provide all the information about vitamins (or there aren't much vitamins in it?)

i woul like to feed a mixed foor just for variety, but i am scared that one will only eat this and the other only eats that... so that the diet isn't complete anymore.
i know this is all in my head, because scatter feeding can solve a lot of this problems. but i have a rat that is skinny and he is not very food orientated. others have a healkthy weight,
how do you do this?

is a RR mix or a homemade mix + fresh veggies enough to keep them healthy, or do i realy need to supplement the food with DR3?

i think this commercial food looks good nutrient wise, but what about the ingredients?

Garvo 5540 rodent mix
complete richly diverse mixture with vegetables, seeds and tasty kibble. Suitable for all sorts of hamsters which sometimes get extra vegetables

Composition:
wheat, barley, St. John's bread, oats peeled, dari red, broken peas, dehydrated alfalfa meal, maize gluten feed, maize, safflowerseed, carrot flakes, palm kernel meal, groundnuts peeled rs/ls, maizemash, rape seed extracted, sunflowerseed striped small, carrotchips, maizeflakes, vegetable Chips, linseed fibers, cane molasses, soya dehulled extracted toasted, beet pulp, lime stones, organic acids

Analytical constituents/kg
crude protein 12,4 %, crude fat 4,7 %, crude fiber 6,9 %, crude ash 4,4 %, calcium 4,61 g, phosphorus 4,12 g, sodium 2,36 g

Addition/kg Vitamins
3a672a Vitamin(e) A 7932 IE, 3a671 Vitamin(e) D3 836 IE, 3a300 Vitamin(e) C 7 mg, 3a700 Vitamin(e) E 92 mg

Addition/kg Traces
copper (3b413 Cu-chelate of glycine hydrate) 13 mg, zinc (3b607 Zn-chelate of glycine hydrate) 62 mg, manganese (3b506 Mn-chelate of glycine hydrate) 46 mg, iron (3b108 Fe-chelate of glycine hydrate) 15 mg, iron (3b103 Fe-sulphate, monohydrate) 25 mg, iodine (3b202 calcium iodate anhydrous) 1 mg, selenium (3b8.12 Se-organic CNCM 1-3399) 0.06 mg, selenium (3b801 sodiium selenite) 0.02 mg
formerly izi

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cyber ratty
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Re: feeding and diet question

Post by cyber ratty » Sat May 23, 2020 10:08 am

I'm no expert in nutrition, but I can answer some of your questions.

Why do you not like supplementing in water? You don't put it in their normal water, just provide a small extra bottle with it in several times a week - most rats love it!

Rat Rations mixes are based on straights, so the reason for supplements being given is that they aren't already included in the food - a commercial mix has them contained in the little brightly coloured biscuits. In the wild, these nutrients would be obtained by eating live prey and scavenging on carrion. If you want to make your own mix which won't need supplements, then use a rabbit food base (I like this one https://www.amazon.co.uk/Extra-Select-P ... 897&sr=8-6)

Feed to suit the majority, and then if a rat needs extras they can be given high calorie meals as a treat.

That hamster food is high in wheat and oats which are hard on kidneys, so not suitable for rats over about 18 months of age. It also lists lime stones, and given that bucks should not have citrus, I would think that's not good at all, and it's low in copper so would still need supplementation. As a general point, hamsters have different requirements from rats so there are probably more aspects that make it unsuitable.

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